Battery issues

The Annexmaster is SURE that there are other references on the website to batteries, but
I did not see them right now, so I will repeat a bit here.

May, 2009. Bill, car 313 suggests: (useful regardless of battery location)
Over time, I have had a lot of dead batteries.
I usually hookup (the positive cable of) a battery charger to the hot side of alternator
 and ground other cable. It works like a champ

*  *  *

Replicars (1976 onward) had the battery under the car toward the rear. This, on the Phaetons, anyhow
made for maintenance headaches. The battery went there because the limited under-hood space was
filled up with other components -- just no room left for a battery.

A battery cut off under the driver's seat, makes it easy to disconnect the battery to work on the car.

Someone had run extension terminals up into the back seat area so you could hook to them
to jump start the battery.

I had suggested once that a little boat door (hinged hatch from a boat supply place) might
work on the back seat floor.

If anyone sees those references on the website, please email me GlassicAnnex@aol.com
and tell me where you found them, so I can add a link on the technical page.
Its pathetic when the Annexmaster can't find stuff HE put on the site!

In March, 2009, owner Dave suggested: (for newer Glassics, with the battery under the car.)

The solution I used was simply to install a (cigarette) lighter under the dash out of sight. Using a Sears brand battery charger/maintainer that comes with an accessory lighter plug in, I just leave it plugged in all of the time and unplug the accessory jack when I'm ready to drive. Its simple and you never have to get under the car. The charger is small and runs about $20 at Sears

 

BACKUP LIGHTS (on my 1973 -- VIN 689)

My car came with backup lights. In checking the pictures,  it looks like some other 1973 era cars also have backup lights and many others do not seem to, so I am not sure whether this was a limited use, like to comply with some state regulations, or whether all of these cars had them during a period.  In any event, one of the lenses was missing when I bought my car.

I happened to be at an old flea market type store that had lots of camper and auto supplies and accessories (new, but old merchandise) and I saw lights that looked similar, so I bought a pair, just in case ($5.00 each).

The lights were an exact match for my Glassic lights, so here are the markings from the original and the new lenses.

OLD:  on the now pitted metal ring holding the lens: PM392 and on the lens itself: STRATOLITE #105  SAE - R121-72  D.O.T

NEW from the supply store: no marking on the metal, and the lens said: SD 0357

By the way, the backup lights have not worked on the car since I got it, and the old bulbs tested ok - so that is another project.

Behind the dashboard -- All red wires!

The majority of the wires, at least in the Replicars (1976-81) are mostly all red and black. This makes life difficult for the restorer, so caution is needed.  The reason for not having color coded wiring is explained by the owner here, but, in addition, think about the following observation by your favorite Annexmaster:

These pictures of behind the dash of car 1290 should serve as a warning to proceed slowly and carefully and mark any wires you remove behind your dash.

Scout instrument panel is the source for gauges

In July, 2008, while restoring her car after a fire, Stacey, car 341 reported:

Scout dashes, maybe I should've said "gauge cluster" in late 60's and 70's Scouts -- the gauges are the same but in a different arrangement. the turn signal blinker indicators are also Scout. The ones in the picture are the actual ones going into my car. I paid $50 for the whole thing!

Melted wires cause odd starter behavior

In Nov. 2008, a series of events happened with car 1254,- a 1978,  around the time of the sale of the car by the Annexmaster. At first attributed to the car's discontent at being sold, the eventual source was less "spiritual". Exactly what caused this is unclear, but hopefully the story can help others.

When preparing the car for inspection, (after several un-eventful years of operating the car) I had started the car 2 or 3 times while adjusting the fast idle. On the third attempt to start it, the solenoid just made a repeated clicking sound, although there had been no sign that the battery was other than fully strong.

I first replaced the solenoid, since the battery HAD been strong on the first 2 starts. No change. I then attempted to jump the car from my van by connecting jumper cables to the battery. Still only clicking at the solenoid but the alternator light lit up on the van, and even speeding up the van engine did not change the clicking.  Upon removing the jumper cables, I saw that they were HOT, not warm, but HOT, as in too hot to hold onto. Clearly not right!

I replace the battery, and the car started fine. It appeared (at the time) that there had been a short in the battery. The next day, after a normal start and test drive by the buyer, the car did not turn off when the ignition was turned off. It did not want to leave! A quick attempt to engage the started while the car was running seemed to free the solenoid and the car turned off ok.

John bought the car, started it up, put it on a trailer, turned it off -- all seemed fine.

Several days later, electrical issues began for the new owner.

Took the Purple mistress (Formerly Angelique) for her maiden run today.  Had a nice ride but as was the problem before I picked her up, the darn motor would not shut off.  It finally took a hammer to the solenoid to turn it off.  To make a long story short I put the old solenoid back in and it worked fine. 

The next contact from John was by phone - I think. At least I do not see an email. As I recall, he went on a cruise and had more issues.

Three days, Coil, Control module, 2 solenoids and a rotor later.  today we found the problem.  It was a short in the harness between the momentary solenoid ignition wire and the regular ignition wire.  Some how they got hot melted grounded and ate  solenoids and control modules in the process.  The symptoms were that sometimes it would crank forever but not start until you let off the starter then start sluggish and smooth out , that was when the ignition wire from the solenoid was shorting out.  I eliminated the wires and bypassed the harness with new wires and everything is working again. 

The lesson here is unclear. Over the years I have heard of wiring issues, and a number of people have gutted and re-wired their cars completely. In this case, was it ALWAYS the wire, and not the battery or solenoid? Did the repeated starts (only 3 as I recall) make the short happen? Did the jump start attempt further aggravate an existing short? Did the short make the battery cables hot, or was there a short in the battery that heated ALL the wiring when jumping the car? If it was a wiring short, why didn't a fuse blow? Did a battery short start the sequence? Was it just old age of the wires that made the short, or the fact that they lay on the hot engine block?

As our cars get older and older, you can't tell where a problem will lead you.
 

A few days later, John wrote:

Funny that you should ask (about blowing a fuse) but after all was done there was a blown 20amp fuse, but I think is just got shorted out while pulling the harness back and forth, and I could not find anything not working. 

I didn't check the heater fan though until after I changed the fuse and think that is where it went.  The ignition on this vehicle did not go over a fuse block or fusible link.  It was wired directly from battery to the switch to the solenoid and coil. 

 It did make me think though why the first owner had a cutoff switch?  Maybe from similar problems in the past before you owned it? (I don't think that the cutoff was for that purpose. The prior owner said it was to "protect" the car at shows - I never used that switch EXCEPT when working with the electric. It was much easier than climbing under the car to disconnect the battery) One problem also contributed to this is that the ground system is not ideal and I added about 4 grounding points where needed.  I am awaiting a 50Amp Circuit breaker from a bus ignition that I will add in line from the switch to the battery.